Frequently Answered Questions for rec.models.railroad


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Prototype questions (part 2 of 2)

Introduction


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Introduction

This digest contains the following parts:

Diesel locomotives

Conrail, F Series

Did Conrail use the F-series diesel?

Conrail had many F-units when it first started off. They were all in the 1600-, 1700- and 1800-series. The majority of these units were F7A's, with a handful of F3A's. Here's a breakdown for you:

	Unit   Former RR  Amount
	------------------------
	F7A    PRR        2
	F7A    NYC        96
	F7A    DL&W       5
	F7A    Erie       6
	F7A    D&RGW      2
	F3A    Erie       4
	F7B    DL&W       6
	F7B    Erie       5
	F7B    PRR        1
	F7B    NYC        7
	F7B    D&RGW      2
	F3B    Erie       4
	FP7A   PRR        18
	FP7A   Reading    3
Notable amongst this roster are a few things:

Diesel locomotives, introduction

Can you give me an introduction to diesel locomotives?

Locomotive manufacturers:

Only EMD and GE are still producing railroad locomotives.

Diesel locomotives, detail

How about more detail on diesels?

Abreviations

	EMD		Electro-Motive Division of General Motors
	GE		General Electric
	Alco		Americal Locomotive Works
	Baldwin		Baldwin Locomotive Works
	Lima		Lima-Hamilton	
	BLH		Baldwin, Lima, Hamilton
	MLW		Montreal Locomotive Works
	FM		Fairbanks-Morse
			and there were a few other small ones.
Only EMD and GE are still producing railroad locomotives EMD's first main model was the FT which I'm sure stood for freight. It had 1350 hp(horse power) They were designed to be semi-permanently coupled and sold usually as sets. They came in both A and B. An A unit is one with a cab and controls, a B unit is an engine without a cab, or with a cab with the controls removed. This was followed by the following engines:
	-------------------------------------
	Unit			Horsepower
	-------------------------------------
	F2A,F2B			1350
	F3A,F3B,F7A,F7B		1500
	F9A,F9B			1750
	-------------------------------------
These are all cab units. (no walkways, and the outer shell is built as part of the frame, to give it strength) They also had B trucks, which means that they had 2 axles on each truck each with a traction motor. (which drives the axle using electricity from the generator).

There was also the E unit, which is like the F unit, except it has 3 axle trucks, called A1A since the center axle is not powered. They also have 2 engines in them, to give them more hp. Here are the models:

	-------------------------------------
	Unit			Horsepower
	-------------------------------------
	EA,  EB			1800
	E1A, E1B		1800
	E2A, E2B		1800
	E3A, E3B		2000
	E4A, E4B		2000
	E5A, E5B		2000
	E6A, E6B		2000
	E7A, E7B		2000
	E8A, E8B		2250 
	E9A, E9B		2400
	-------------------------------------
These also are cab unit style.The model number on both of these changed usually when EMD made a change - either externally or internally.

Before making the F7, EMD introduced a new model type, called the BL1 It stood for Branch Line, had 1500 hp, and had the same motor as the F7 and GP7. (which I will explain later) They followed this by the BL2, although it is argued what the change was. This engine had most of the cab style, with notches along each side, that would allow the engineer to see behind him better.

This was followed by the GP7, which was concurrently produced with the F7. The GP series stood for General Purpose, and had walkways along each hood. It came in passenger and freight versions. Passenger versions had a steam generator in the short hood (typically called the nose) to heat the passenger cars. This engine had B trucks and 1500 hp.

Here is a list of GP style engines:

	-------------------------------------
	Unit			Horsepower
	-------------------------------------
	GP7			1500
	GP9			1750 
	GP15			1500
	GP18			1800
	GP20			2000
	GP28			1800
	GP30			2250
	GP35			2500
	GP38			2000
	GP39			2300
	GP40			3000
	GP40X			3500
	GP50			3500/3600
	GP60			3800
	-------------------------------------
The EMD currently builds is the GP60.

The next frieght style is the SD series, which stands for Special Duty. These have C trucks, instead of B trucks, and are typically a lot heavier then their GP counter part.

Here is a list of their models:

	-------------------------------------
	Unit			Horsepower
	-------------------------------------
	SD7			1500 
	SD9			1750 
	SD18			1800 
	SD24			2400 
	SD28			1800 
	SD35			2500 
	SD38			2000 
	SD39			2300 
	SD40			3000 
	SD45			3600 
	SD45X			4200 
	SD50			3500/3600 
	SD60			3800 
	SD70			4000 
	-------------------------------------
The SD 60 is the current model, the SD70 is the next model they are introducing. They have built 2 demonstrators, and one railroad has ordered 6 (#2501-2506) of them (Norfilk Southern). There are also 3 demonstrators (#7000-7002). Most of these engines were used for freight, but they could be purchased with steam generators(usually located in the short hood) for passenger service. EMD also produced a couple with the steam generator in the rear. These were the following models: SDP40, SDP45, GP40P and GP40TC. The GPs are a 2 axle configuration. Then there is the later F series, which were basically like the GP and SD, but had a cowling over the engine, instead of walkways. This cowling is not part of the structural support, unlike the earlier F series.

These engines include:

	-------------------------------------
	Unit			Horsepower
	-------------------------------------
	F40PH			3000  <- standard Amtrak engine everyone
					 knows and loves :)	
	SDP40F			3000     later rebuilt into F40s
	F45, FP45		3600	 the FP had a steam generator in it
	-------------------------------------
We also have the SD40F,SD50F and SD60F which are SD40,SD50/SD60's with cowling over them instead of walkways. These were all bought by Canadian railroads's.

Now to the switchers, another long list! A switcher is typically, small, lightweight, and has a cab at one end, and no nose, instead it usually has large windows for visibility. EMD started out with the NC which had 900 hp, and was experimental, and then followed with the following models:

	-------------------------------------
	Unit			Horsepower
	-------------------------------------
	SC,SW			600	(SC stood for cast frame,
					SW stood for welded frame)	
	NC, NC1, NC2, NW	900	(c for cast, w for welded)
	NW1, NW1A		900
	-------------------------------------
Originally, "S" stood for 600 and "N" stood for 900, but that was changed later.
	-------------------------------------
	Unit			Horsepower
	-------------------------------------
	NW2			1000
	NW4			 900
	SW1			 600
	NW3,NW5			1000
	SW8			 800
	SW600			 600
	SW900			 900
	SW7			1200
	SW9,SW1200		1200
	SW1000,SW1001		1000
	SW1500, MP15		1500
	-------------------------------------
The MP stands for Multi Purpose, still looks like a switcher though. The MP is the current production model. The other odd model EMD produced was the DD series, which had DD trucks (4 axles, 4 traction motors per truck) These were double ended diesels, and were roughly like 2 engines put together in one.

They had the following:

	-------------------------------------
	Unit			Horsepower
	-------------------------------------
	DD35A, DD35B		5000
	DDA40X			6600
	-------------------------------------
Only Union Pacific had the DDA40X and the DD35A. Both UP and Southern Pacific had the DD35B.

GE's roster is a bit easier to describe. They started with the U series, which stood for Universal. They are either B or C, depending on whether they had B trucks or C trucks. The U series had the following models:

	-------------------------------------
	Unit			Horsepower
	-------------------------------------
	U18B			1800
	U23B,U23C		2250
	U25B,U25C		2500
	U28B,U28C		2800
	U30B,U30C		3000
	U33B,U33C		3300
	U36B,U36C		3600
	-------------------------------------
x There was also a U50 and U50C which was a double U25, with either 2 sets of B trucks on a span bolster (U50) or on C trucks (U50C).

All GE models use their hp in hundreds as part of the model designation along with the type of trucks and the engine series.

Sometime in the late 70's (1977 I think) they dropped the U series, and went to the -7 series. All further models looked like this:

	-------------------------------------
	Unit			Horsepower
	-------------------------------------
	B23-7, C23-7		2300
	B30-7, C30-7		3000
	B36-7, C36-7		3600
	-------------------------------------
I don't believe they carried the C232 or U33 into the -7 line. In the mid 80's, (around 1984) they dropped the -7 line and went to the -8 line, which is the current production line. These are the following models:
	-------------------------------------
	Unit			Horsepower
	-------------------------------------
	B32-8, C32-8		3200
	B36-8, C36-8		3600
	B39-8, C39-8		3900
	B40-8, C40-8		4000
	-------------------------------------
The B40-8 and C40-8 are the current model in production. They have also flipped the designation to DASH-8 40B and DASH-8 40C, although many railroads retain the older designation.

There is also a modification on the current production of engines, that being a cowl (like described before) or a safety cab. For EMD's, the wide nose is designated by adding an M after the model name (like SD60M or GP60M) on GE is is a W, (Like CW40-8,DASH-8 40BW). They also have the full width cowl with a W (DASH 8-40CW) bought only by Canadian National and BC Rail (British Columbia Railway).

Most of this information is in the "Second Diesel Spotters Guide" or "Diesel Spotters Update". I won't go into the other RR's, since I'm not rewriting their books, but this gives you a general description of the two most prominent locomotive makers. GE currently is producing more than EMD, EMD had been on top since the beginning. (of mass-produced diesel locomotives)


Diesel locomotives, theory

How does a diesel locomotive work?

Actually, this is a trick question. Locomotives come in:

The diesel engines are huge internal combustion engines (sometimes more than one per locomotive), named after Rudolf Diesel who patented the concept in 1892. In a diesel-electric they are used to power electric generators, and the electricity is used to drive electric motors. These are called traction motors and one is attached by a gear system to each powered axle.

Diesel-mechanic locomotives are those that work just like a diesel car or lorry, they have a motor, gear box, etc. Their power is limited because the mechanical parts cannot stand even a thousand hp.

Diesel-hydraulic are those which use a hydraulic gear box. The principle can be illustrated this way: imagine a lake and put there a mill at the margin, now imagine a big fan driven by the motor that makes the water in the lake go round in circles. The result is that the wheel off the mill starts turning also. This is roughly how hydraulic transmission works. [or you can think of an automobile's automatic transmission...]

It turns out to be very difficult to build these to handle the large loads involved, so all modern locomotives [in the United States - see below] are of the diesel-electric variety.

Until 1980, there were still modern diesel-hydraulic locomotives built by the Deutsche Bundesbahn in West Germany (three major series: the good old two- motored 220/221 (V200), the light 211/212 with one motor and the cab in the middle and the 215/216/217/218/219 with one motor/two cabs for mixed service). Today there are no diesel locomotives built in Germany, because there are so many Russian or Bulgarian diesel-electric engines from the Deutsche Reichsbahn (East Germany). New diesel locomotives will be built in the diesel electric technology with 3-phased AC transmission.

Finally we have the steam-electric. I don't have the references in front of me, but I believe the New York Central experimented with an engine which looked like an F3 but which had a coal-powered steam boiler which as used to run a generator, with the rest of the system as in a diesel-electric. This is even more speculative than the diesel-hydraulic description, so don't bet any money on it.

There is also a electro-diesel engine in the UK. That strange beast is a diesel-electric locomotive wich can also pick up power from an overhead wire.


Diesel locomotives, naming

How are diesel locomotives identified? North American diesel locomotives are designated by the number of powered axles, divided into trucks. The letters A,B,C,D stand for 1 through 4 axles, so an EMD FT (see below) with 2 trucks each of which contains two driving axles is a B-B. Early locomotives were made with A1A trucks. (2 axles, the center one unpowered)

A units have a cab with controls for the engineer. B units are basically A units with no controls. Slugs are a cut-down frame filled with concrete. They have only traction motors, and receive power from an attached engine.

A slightly different convention is used in Europe, possibly due to the wider range of designs employed. The european version is as follows:

The number of non-driven axles is determined by an arabic number: 1 = 1 axle, 2 = 2 axles in one frame, and so on.

The number of driven axles is determined by an uppercase letter: A = 1 driven axle, B = 2 driven axles in one frame, and so on.

A small 0 (or o) after an uppercase letter means that each axle is driven by its own motor.

Parentheses () around letters and numbers indicate they are built into one frame or bogie.

An apostrophe (') after a number, a letter or a parenthesed expression means that these axle(s) are situated in a bogie, independent from the frame.

Independent vehicles are separated by a plus (+) sign. If you see something like 2'2'2'2'2'2'.... this is probably an articulated train.

Examples:
2'C2' = a bogie of two axles, three driven axles in the frame, and another bogie of two axles
Bo'Bo' = two bogies, each with two axles, each axle driven by its own motor
(1'C)'(C'1)' = two bogies, each with three axles driven by one motor and one independent axle

In Britain, the convention is slightly different again. The brackets and apostrophes are not used. A normal locomotive with two independent two-axled bogies will be a Bo-Bo. However a few older classes, notably class EM1 (later class 76), have (or rather had) a link between the bogies to avoid transmitting the entire tractive effort through the bogie/body joint. These locomotives are referred to as Bo+Bo.


Electric locomotives

Electric locomotives, detail

What are the most important electric locomotives?

SBB CFF FFS (Switzerland)
Ce 6/8 II; (1'C)'(C1')'; 1.65 MW; 65 km/h
Be 6/8 III; (1'C)'(C1')'; 2.575 MW; 75 km/h
The `Crocodile', maybe the most famous electric locomotive ever. It was built since 1919 for transporting heavy trains over the Gotthard. This articulated locomotive was used until 1970.
Models of the Ce 6/8 II: Maerklin 1; Roco H0; Arnold N.
Models of the Be 6/8 III: Maerklin H0; Maerklin Z.
Re 6/6 620; Bo'Bo'Bo'; 7.8 MW; 140 km/h
This is still the most powerful locomotive (with one frame) of the world. It was built since 1972 for all trains on mountain lines.
Models: Hag H0; Lima H0; Hobbytrain N.
Re 4/4 460; Bo'Bo'; 6.1 MW; 230 km/h
The `Locomotive 2000' in the newest technology, designed by Pinin- farina, built since 1991. Variants of the 460 will be built for the BLS (Switzerland) and for the VR (Finland).
Models: Hag H0; Maerklin H0; Roco H0.

DB DR (Germany)
Class 118 (E18); 1'Do1'; 3.04 MW; 150 km/h
From 1935 to 1955 these locomotives were built for fast passenger trains. They were used until 1980, in Austria (OeBB 1018) until 1990.
Models: Maerklin H0 (DB 118), Roco H0 (DB 118, OeBB 1018).
Class 103; Co'Co'; 7.78 MW; 200 km/h
Since 1970, this powerful engine is used for all the fast InterCity trains in Germany.
Models: Fleischmann H0, Maerklin H0, Roco H0; Fleischmann N, Trix N; Maerklin Z.
Class 120; Bo'Bo'; 5.4 MW; 200 km/h
The prototypes of this universal locomotive with asynchronous three phase motors were built in 1979; since 1987 more 120s are in regular service for InterCity and freight trains.
Models: Fleischmann H0, Maerklin H0; Fleischmann N; Maerklin Z.

SNCF (France)
CC 7100; Co'Co'; 160 km/h
In 1955 one of these locomotives established a new world record with 331 km/h. They were used for heavy passenger and freight trains.
Models: Rivarossi H0; Roco N.
BB 26000; Bo'Bo'; 200 km/h
The SYBIC locomotive, with synchronous three phase motors, is built since 1990. It is used for all sorts of trains in the whole country.
Model: Maerklin H0.
SJ (Sweden)
Rc1, Rc2, Rc3, Rc4, Rc5; Bo'Bo'; 160 km/h
The Rc series by ABB, based on thyristor technology, was built since 1967. Variants of the Rc are used in Austria (OeBB 1043), Norway (NSB El 16) and USA (Amtrak AEM7).
Models: Maerklin H0 (SJ Rc2, OeBB 1043), Roco H0 (SJ Rc5; NSB El 16)

Electric locomotives, theory

How do electric locomotives work?

Electric locomotives receive power at anywhere from about 500 to 25,000 volts. At up to about 1,500 volts, a third rail is typically used. At higher voltages, more separation is needed around the conductor for safety, but the current is reduced and so the conductor can be lighter, and hence the overhead wire is preferred. Power from overhead wires is conducted to the locomotive via a pantograph.

In general, lower voltage locomotives use direct current, while higher voltage ones use alternating current, but this is by no means the rule.

Traditional electric engines work in one of two fashions: either the motors are directly supplied with full voltage or the current is transformed to lower voltage by a transformer in the locomotive, then it may be directly transmitted to the motors or rectified if DC motors are used.

The earliest electric locomotives had one or two large motors in the middle of the frame, which drove the wheels mechanically, similarly to the transmission of steam engines. Since 1940 or so, each axle has its own motor; usually a modern locomotive has two or three bogies with two or three axles each.

AC locomotives transform the current to lower voltage with a transformer, control is provided by transformer taps, or in some modern designs, by choppers. Many modern AC Locomotives use DC traction motors, others use asynchronous (induction) motors.

The newest engines have a DC circuit which is either fed by the DC from the overhead cable or by the transformed and rectified AC. The electricity from this circuit is then converted electronically into three phase current of variable frequency and voltage, by which the motors, which can be built very simple, are fed. This new technology allows the engines to feed the electrical energy back into the overhead cable while braking.

DC locomotives traditionally controlled the current and voltage by changing the motor connections, from series to parallel and by adding resistors during starting. Recent designs use solid state "choppers" to control the current, some use AC (induction/asynchronous) motors, even if the supply is DC.

Most of the fast trains of the world have electric traction. It is expensive to build transformers and overhead cables above the railway lines, but the engines are much more powerful and less heavy than Diesel engines because they don't have to carry their fuel around. For example, a modern four axle engine (80 t) can easily have a power of more than 6 MW. The electric engines don't need a mechanical transmission because the motors can develop high power at all speeds. This is particularly true for the new three-phase current technology. Electric locomotives are "clean": they don't pollute the local environment, although the power plants may depending on how they generate the electricity.

Electrical transmission from the power source is best done at high voltage since this reduces losses due to resistance and can be accomplished with lighter cables (since the current is reduced). Alternating current is the preferred method since AC can be easily converted to DC and AC will travel further along a cable before it needs to be transformed.

There are a wide variety of current systems, including:

  1. AC 25000 V, 50 Hz: Portugal, north France, Great Britain, Denmark, Finland, Italy (in the future), south-east Europe, CIS
  2. AC 15000 V, 16.66 Hz: Norway, Sweden, Germany, Switzerland, Austria
  3. AC 11000 V, 25 or 60 Hz: USA (Amtrak north-east Corridor)
  4. DC 3000 V: Spain, Belgium, Italy, Poland, CIS
  5. DC 1500 V: south France, Netherlands
  6. DC 650/750/1200 V, third rail: south England, urban railways
  7. 25kV AC 50Hz was used in the London area of the former Great Eastern and Tilbury lines, where overhead clearances were too small to install 25kV wires. It's recently been converted to 25kV.
France also has engines equiped for 25KV AC and 1500V DC in areas where the route takes it over track supplied by either voltage, such as the Marseille to Italy run.

50kV AC 50Hz is used on the Sishen-Saldanha (?sp) iron ore railway in South Africa, which runs across the Namib desert and where there must hence be unusually long intervals between substations. [Actually it may be in Namibia now - I don't know where it runs in relation to the border]

1200V DC is now sadly demised in Britain :-(

The european railway companies have several types of locomotives that are compatible to two or more of these systems. For example in France, all the TGVs (Train a Grande Vitessse = high speed train) have two or three systems. There are plans to reduce the number of electric systems in Europe, but this seems to become very expensive.

Electric locomotives, TGV

What can anybody tell me about the TGV? The TGV (Train a grande vitesse) is an electric, high speed train of the SNCF (Societe nationale des chemins de fer francais). It consists of two locomotives (each with only one cab) and an articulated passenger train between them.

The TGV holds the world speed record:
In 1981, a TGV Sud-Est reached 380.4 km/h (236.4 mph).
In 1988 the German InterCity Experimental reached 406.9 km/h (252.8 mph) but two years later the French got their record back, with a TGV Atlantique at 515.3 km/h (320.2 mph).

The TGVs circulate on two high speed lines: Paris--Lyon and Paris--Le Mans/Tours. New lines will be built to the North (Paris--Sangatte/Lille/Bruxelles) and to the East (Paris-- Baudrecourt). The existing high speed lines are going to be extended to Bruxelles and Marseille.

The TGV roster includes:

  1. TGV 001
    1 experimental train, built in 1972, with gas turbines. Today out of service.

  2. TGV sud-est (TGV SE)
    108 trains, each with 2 locomotives and 8 passenger sections, in service since 1981 between Paris and the south-east of France. The end bogies of the passenger consist are also motorized. These trains are painted orange, with a black window area and white stripes.

    Since 1990, they are equipped with pneumatic suspension and more comfortable seats. The interior seating is arranged in rows (open plan area only).

    Two trainsets can be coupled together. The pantographs for DC are those mounted in `front' of each locomotive, the standard type Faiveley AM is used, in the DC system both of them are raised. The pantographs for AC are a new, complicated two-level development. For AC operation, only one of them is raised, usually the one on the second locomotive, or at double trainsets on the first and last loco (to keep the maximum distance between them).

    Capacity: 368 seats. Speed: 270 km/h. Length: 200.1 m. Weight: 418 tonnes. Power: 6.95 MW.

    There are several versions of the TGV SE:

  3. TGV atlantique (TGV A)
    105 trains, each with 2 locomotives and 10 passenger sections. The first TGV equipped with the more powerful synchronous motors They have been in service between Paris and the west of France since 1989.

    The TGV-A trains are painted silver, with a blue window area. The doors are marked with colors: ocean blue-green for 2nd class, cherry red for 1st class and bright yellow for the bar. There are 3 first class sections, one bar and six 2nd class sections. There are open plan areas (with the seats arranged in rows), but also face-to-face groups (Club duo and Club quatre in 1st class, Carre in 2nd class).

    There are rooms for travelling groups (Salon in 1st class, Kiosque in 2nd class) at both ends of the passenger consists.

    Two trainsets can be coupled together. The pantographs are the new type GPU, only one of them is used per trainset.

    Capacity: 485 seats. Speed: 300 km/h. Length: 237.6 m. Weight: 444 tonnes. Power: 8.8 MW.
    Models: Jouef H0, Lima H0.

  4. AVE (Alta velocidad en Espana)
    24 trains (2 locos, 8 passenger sections) were built in 1992 for high speed lines in Spain. These trains are painted beige.

    Capacity: 329 seats. Speed: 240 km/h. Length: 200.1 m. Power: 8.8 MW.
    Model: Jouef H0.

  5. TGV reseau (TGV R)
    A version of the TGV A with only 8 passenger section and 377 seats. 80 trains will be built 1993/94. These trains will be used at the Nord line, with connections to Brussels, and all the other lines.

  6. Eurostar (ex Transmanche Supertrain = TMST)
    This is a train for the connection between London and Paris or Brussels.

    The trainsets are painted in light grey, sun yellow and dark blue. Their unusual shape is influenced by the small loading gauge in Britain.

    Unlike the TGV, the Eurostar has no electric cable on the roof, so both pantographs need to be raised. The trains are compatible with four electrical systems, including side rail DC as used in southern England (each locomotive has eight retractable contact shoes). 38 trains are built: 31 trains with 18 passenger sections + locomotives, 7 trains with 14 passenger sections + locomotives.

    Capacity: 710 seats. Speed: 300 km/h. Length: 393.7 m. weight: 752.4 tonnes. Power: 12.2 MW.
    Model: Jouef H0 (announced)

  7. TGV deux niveaux (TGV 2N)
    To transport even more passengers in peak times, these trains have two floors. The entrances lead to the lower floor, the connections between the sections are only between the top floors.

    The pantographs are the new computer-controlled pneumatic type CX ones.

    These trains will have 547 seats in 8 passenger sections, 45 trains are ordered for 1996.

  8. TGV Paris-Bruxelles-K"oln/Amsterdam
    This is a version of the TGV R for all 4 electric systems. 36 trains are ordered by DB, NS, SNCB and SNCF.

  9. TGV Texas
    It is said that The TGV will be exported to Texas as well, but I have no further information about this.

Gas turbine engines

What is a "gas-turbine" locomotive?

General Electric produced several species of gas-turbines, as did Baldwin. These locos were basically the same as a diesel-electric, except that the prime mover was a gas turbine. The only successful production models came from GE, all of which were sold to the Union Pacific. These came in essentially two types:

Thirty large turbines were produced by GE. Compared to first generation diesels, these machines were reliable. They consumed huge amounts of "Bunker C," a thick black oil which was considered waste at the time and was initially very cheap. Heated tenders [to keep the fuel from solidifying] were provided for each locomotive, custom made from old steam tenders. Bunker C became more expensive when it became an ingredient for making plastics. Increased fuel expense doomed the gas-turbine, which could not operate with the fuel efficiency of the diesel. [No way was ever found to cool the turbine blades like a piston engine cooling system so the turbine had to operate at a lower less efficient temperature than a diesel.]

Gas-turbines were in revenue service roughly from 1950 to 1969. None of the first generation turbines remain. At least one of the second generation turbines is on display (in Ogden, Utah).

Gas-turbines have also been used in Europe. The SNCF (French National Railway Society) introduced its Turbotrains ETG (Element a Turbine a Gaz) and RTG (Rame a Turbine a Gaz), very noisy passenger units of four to five wagons, in the sixties. They can reach 180 km/h and are still in use as fast trains on the non-electrificated lines today.

The Canadian turbine train is the United Aircraft Turbotrain. This was operated by CN, then VIA, in the 1970s, but was retired between 1979 and 1983. There are no more Turbos in Canada. (Amtrak also tested a version of this train between Boston and New York).

The other European companies have stopped their tests with gas turbine traction, because gas turbines consume large amounts of fuel and produce a very loud high frequency noise.